Thinking about Invention & Revision

3/19/2024

On one end of the Spectrum: Invention
Clark identifies the ways that the way we understand invention is heavily influenced by classical rhetoric (Aristotle, Plato). The legacy of that is that Invention feels false in the classroom.

In discussing Writer's Block she outlines the following:

1. The Fear of taking a risk.
2. No appetite for Chaos.
3. Preference for judging, rather than generating ideas
4.Inability to incubate.
5. Lack of Motivation.

And on the other end of things: Revision
It doesn't feel like a new observation now, but in 1982, what Nancy Sommers said about revision was revelatory--in part because it was the first time someone actually paid attention to revision strategies as something that defines a good writer:

Consider the two revision strategies she identifies

Sommers identifies several strategies that experienced writers use to revise effectively. One strategy is "global revision," where writers reconsider the purpose and audience of their writing, often leading to major changes in content and structure. Another strategy is "local revision," which involves refining the details of the writing, such as word choice and sentence structure.

In contrast, students tend to focus more on local revision, often making superficial changes without considering the overall effectiveness of their writing. Sommers argues that this difference in approach is due to students' lack of experience and suggests that teaching students to approach revision more like experienced writers could improve their writing skills.

How Sommer's came to this place, is outlined in the opening from another of tonight's reading's "Concept 5: Writing is (Also Always) a Cognitive Activity. This is the kind of early research in Composition where folks trying to work with new students in the university (via open admissions) were, as Dryer says mapping "mental processes" of writers.

For Tonight's Prompt: CONSIDER EITHER INVENTION OR REVISION from tonight's reading. Then identify one or more ideas from Threshold Concepts in writing "Concept 5" that helps you to think about what you aren't doing/are doing/should be doing in a writing classroom to help students understand themselves as writers and understand their process better.

Once you've posted your response, read your colleague's responses, and be ready to have a discussion about what you find interesting across these discussions.

22 Comments

Cassandra Peterson

3/19/2024 03:29:24 pm

In looking over the ideas from Concept 5, the section about reflection struck a chord with me. Mostly because when it comes to revision in writing, I am lost on how to provide my students with the opportunity to successfully revise their papers. My students are required to do 2 drafts currently, which seems to help with each given essay assignment. However, upon further examination of data, my students writing scores are not improving in the long run. this boils down to two issues, with the first being that some students ONLY make the revisions that I spoon-feed them, and the second being that a majority of students refuse to do a second draft. No amount of incentivization or discipline has changed this in my classroom and it is discouraging. I truly believe that revision and reflection are opportunities to make and learn from mistakes, but my students don't seem to be doing that. I wonder if anyone else is experiencing this lack of risk-taking behavior in students, and if they have found any reflective strategies affective in their middle/high-school classes.

Peyton DiTullio

3/19/2024 03:35:39 pm

I feel like a possible incentive could be using a different rubric for the second draft versus the first draft. The rubric for the first draft could be a standard writing rubric whereas the rubric for the second draft could solely be about revision/solely measure changes, reflections, and risk taking in the writing. That way, students are being graded on how much effort they put into revising (aka the process) rather than the writing itself (aka the product). This would also give students who need more of a challenge more opportunity to do well... and it would challenge the ones who need more of a challenge (for example, if an A- student did no revisions between the first and second draft, he/she would get a 0% rather than another A- according to the "revision" rubric).

Devon Melo

3/19/2024 03:41:29 pm

Definitely experiencing a similar thing with my tenth graders. I've done writing reflections and overall term reflections with all my classes (kind of what Peyton was mentioning). With their 5-para essays, I have my tenth graders write a comment pointing out the strongest and weakest part of their essay to have a quick moment of reflection. In years past, I've had students write down 3 things they would change in their papers on a notecard and hand it in. For term reflections, I just give them a google form and a list of questions where they respond to honestly on what they've improved/struggled on this term. It depends on what I'm feeling, to be honest.

3/19/2024 03:30:50 pm

Something from Threshold Concepts of Writing that I find myself doing in my own classroom is encouraging reflection, not just after the writing process, but during as well. According to the author of this text, many writers find the process of reflection challenging due to one or more of the following reasons: writers believe (or want to believe) it only happens once the product is complete, writers assume it is something they do already/that they do not need prompting to do it, writers think reflection only considers how they feel about the product, some writers have never done this before and/or don't think they need to. The first time I implemented reflection during the writing process, I was pretty pleased with the results. I gave the students my feedback (without a grade) and then gave them an opportunity to write a reflection. Afterwards, I had my students share their reflections with one another as well as give each other more feedback. Once I did this, many of my students asked me if they could "change some things" (which was already my plan). Before allowing them to "change things" I had them write a "plan for revision" where they detailed what they were going to change and why. I found this process to be very meaningful as students seemed more willing to take risks in order to improve their writing (some even deleted a page and/or started over altogether). As stated in the text, "reflection allows writers to recall, reframe, and relocate knowledge and practices; therefore. it must be worked at in order to be most effectively learned and practiced."

3/19/2024 03:35:25 pm

I was also drawn to the reflection section, but had not thought about making my students write an actual reflection on the feedback they received. I've only had them scan comments and write a second draft. This is a very cool activity that I would like to try with my 8th graders. However, I worry about testing and writing fatigue among my students due to them having 4 MCAS tests and 9 benchmarks, not including major essays and projects. I wonder if a shortened version of a reflection might work better in my particular case.

3/19/2024 03:40:08 pm

I have students write what they are worried about in their drafts before the workshop with other students and before they turn it in to me. Comments to the student writer should focus on those worries. Then the student writes a revision plan to address their worries using the feedback. Then once the revision is completed, I ask students to write about the success of that revision and what they would do if they had one more revision left. All that writing gets turned in and I count it (see what I say about assessment) as part of how they earn the B or A grade.

Sara

3/19/2024 03:32:34 pm

One of the concepts from Threshold Concepts that stuck out to me was that “habituated practice leads to automaticity”. Innately, I understand the concept that students get better at writing by writing, but I struggle to balance meaningful engagement with my writing in the classroom. For example, when we read a chapter or scene from a play, the “writing” for the day is usually heavily focused on comprehension or interpretation of a text. I wonder if those types of “shorter” writing responses are sufficient enough to count as “practice” that would lead to automaticity. I ask students to complete an essay as our summative but that is always at the end of the unit. Does Anson think that students need longer and more individualized opportunities for writing exposure? I think back to my AP language days where I was reading a chapter from ‘They Say, I Say” a night and writing long-form writing responses…do I need to be increasing the rigor in my classes to that level? I guess my question is what does this look like in my classroom? I don't want to fail my students by not providing enough opportunity for writing; I just struggle how to manage teaching all the standards (vocab, grammar, speaking, listening, reading) AND allowing sufficient enough time for the kind of writing that I want my students to be doing.

Nick

3/19/2024 03:41:08 pm

Sara,

I'm finding myself asking a lot of the same questions you are! Writing more often is something I was thinking about to reduce the load on student's minds that writing is, but like you I'm trying to see where I can fit it into the day and still have it be an authentic experience for my students.

My first thought is a daily journal where students are allowed to write about whatever they want, as an ungraded warm-up. I think we talked about something like this in class earlier? It's something I want to try.

3/19/2024 03:44:25 pm

Sara and Nick! I'm thinking a lot of the same things you guys are saying. I have been slacking a little with the random free writes I give my tenth graders, and wonder if they are actually "doing" something with their writing practice. I am unsure what to turn it into and if I should do consistent writing journals moving forward.

3/19/2024 03:35:23 pm

After all of my stuff about Inoue and Assessment, it can't surprise you to know that I locate both discussions of revision and invention in the assessment. I can't say it enough: assessment is how learning is monetized for students--it's how they figure out what they are getting out of an assignment, and it typically dictates how much they are willing to put in to it. I want students to risk as thinkers--because to think an idea is to risk an idea. And, as the quote I included in the prompt indicates: students are risk averse. And I want students to not just write well, I want them to learn habits of mind that allow them to be successful writers in any circumstance--that is from Howard Tinberg, who, incidentally, is a big muckity muck and teaches right down the road at Bristol Community college. I want them to be able to identify why they make the rhetorical choices they make--because it is only in that metacognition that they really learn what writing is and how to do it successfully. So I include as part of my assessment of the success in a piece of student writing 1) the documents that they produced that led them to write what they write, so early drafts, notes, post-its, records of conference discussions, whatever it looks like AND I ask them to trace for me how they got from those starting points to where they ended up--so reflection. This is one of the ways I try to get around what Chris Anson calls "sedimented" writing (and also plagiarism), which is writing that fulfiils a prompt without requiring students to really give it any thought.
And I do the same, it probably goes without saying, for revision. I ask students big questions about their drafts and I ask them to answer those big questions before they sketch out a revision plan. Then I ask them to reflect on their process of revision. This is how I try to demonstrate the difference between cognition that Tinberg talks about and metacognition--the thinking and the knowing how and why you are thinking that way.

3/19/2024 03:41:49 pm

I appreciate that you included a discussion of your pedagogical practices as they are rooted in these readings. As a former and current student of yours, one thing that has stuck out to me is that you are the ONLY professor and teacher I've ever had that has asked for the notes along the way, a revision letter, and reflective writing pieces attached to our final product. These practices make me feel seen and valued as a writer and I can tell you value the whole process and not just the final product. I am going to implement these practices in hopes that my students feel the same positive effects.

Devon

3/19/2024 03:45:18 pm

Same!!! ^^^

3/19/2024 03:36:03 pm

Invention - There is a part in Threshold Concepts that refers to the work by theorists, Vygotsky, Moffett, and Berthoff that states, "writing comes from full engagement of the entire writer" (Threshold Concepts 75). It's located under 5.1 or writing is an expression of embodied cognition. I completely resonate with this idea. When it comes to my practice, I teach grade 10 CP level students, who, for the most part, are not engaged or invested in the content/skills surrounding our class. Their motivation to write feels very low at the moment. This line really resonates with me because by understanding this about the majority of my students, then I should be doing something to alter this in the classroom. Dr. Torda brought up choice, which I definitely do a lot more of, but this is an area where I struggle with at times making the content more engaging/applicable to them when I'm trying to get through the state standards. However, on the flip side, I see my grade 12 H course in a different light. I see them more fully engaged in the material, I see many have fewer fears of taking risks and like exploring new content, and many are brainstorming ideas. I think bottom line it has to do with experience and skill, and for students who are more advanced this idea of invention will come more natural to them over time and with practice.

Revision - The only thing I want to consider my take on revision is to incorporate it more in my classroom. In past years, I've assigned a piece of writing, that piece of writing is due, it gets graded, and returned to the student. I've never had a student ask to revise assignments, and that may be part of the reason why I don't incorporate it enough, but I don't know.

3/19/2024 03:43:49 pm

Devon, do you think about what conditions might make your honors students more engaged and willing to risk than your CP students? It's worth thinking about--Inoue might be helpful there.

3/19/2024 03:43:56 pm

I also teach 10th grade. Do you think, after MCAS next week, you will try some writing activities that aren't as aligned with the state standards? I know for my kids, they are really eager to do something new and different, so I'm doing a murder mystery unit between MCAS and April break. My kids tell me that when I give them prompts that don't feel like "school prompts" they are more engaged.

Kasey P

3/19/2024 03:45:00 pm

I completely agree with the Invention section of yours! I too have certain classes that lack motivation and because of that, the writing feels like it's missing something. I've been working towards changing my curriculum (pretty regularly this year for 9th grade!) to try and further that engagement. The student choice has worked great for me this year and some of my curriculum experimentation has worked. Hoping to find something that sticks!

3/19/2024 03:36:22 pm

One idea from "Threshold Concept" that made me look at writing in the classroom in a different way was the idea of embodied cognition. I've always known that writing is a hard task, but I always looked at it as "the thing we do in English class". For me, I suppose, writing is not a big deal. But for my students, it may be taking a ton more "brain power" to write than it does me.

Looking at writing in the classroom in this way helps me understand my student's point of view a bit better. I should be treating writing in my classroom differently- acknowledging the difficulties of writing as a cognition-heavy task that needs the supports that comes with that. I need to adapt the way I write in the classroom to both give students the space they need mentally to write, while also trying to remove the barriers that some students might face in writing, and help them develop the skills to make writing less cognitively stressful.

3/19/2024 03:42:34 pm

I find that a good way to incorporate writing activities with low risk and barrier is by giving at least one wacky journal a week. I have given my students some absurd would you rathers and asked them to defend their point. they get to argue with their friends about it aloud after which my eighth graders love to do.

3/19/2024 03:44:47 pm

This is a great reflection that I sure relate to! It takes a conscious effort to put ourselves in our students' shoes and imagine what it must be like to be in high school again with all the demands and newness that comes along with that. They don't have the experience and tools we have, so it does take effort to go back to the basics sometimes to outline the process in a way that is both effective and encouraging.

3/19/2024 03:41:09 pm

When it comes to invention and revision, I will say that both can be really challenging for students, but I would argue that from my own experience teaching, I have often seen students struggle the most with revisions. Oftentimes, perhaps due to lack of self-confidence with writing, my students will write a paper and never want to look at it again. They just say to me, "Can you just tell me what to fix", and while I'm glad that they are willing to revise, they don't typically take their own measures to reassess what they have written. Overtime, this has resulted in my own incorporation of requiring revisions as part of the grading process. I appreciated a lot about some of the major concepts from "Concept 5", but in particular I gravitated towards the section on reflection being critical for writer's development. In this section Taczak discusses how sometimes reflection isn't viewed as part of a student's typical process, but when incorporated well, students can become more attentive to their work and reframe their works (79). I have always felt revision is important, but the more I've worked at teaching, the more I have made it an integral part of my classes so that my students can begin to be more attentive to their thought processes and how they can better their delivery.
In regards to revision, I try my best to utilize both global and local revision styles. For bigger essays, I don't find that just local revisions are helpful. In Sommer's article, she describes how students can become fixated on just re-wording as opposed to looking at bigger picture. I think when we focus on just those finite details, students lose the fact that revision isn't just wording, it's the quality of the thought itself. Recently, I have started incorporating elements of peer revision, which I know was referred to as more effective in theory than in practice, but oftentimes I use this for my global revisions. I have students exchange papers and color-code particular elements of the essay. By doing this, students had a reader that was able to draw attention to what was included or what wasn't, from an audience perspective. This process was intended to focus on a lot of structure and fortunately, my students loved this! I think this helps students recognize major components of their writing and what they needed to focus on moving forward. For local revisions, I try to meet one-on-one with checklists for students and we walk through identifying those together. I find this moderately helpful, but moving forward, getting students to focus on the smaller issues is something I want to work harder on!

Dawna

3/19/2024 03:46:01 pm

I have the same experience with students revising. They just want me to proofread their writing and tell them what to fix, and they don't want to listen to why they need to make those changes. They're making writing choices because I tell them to, not because they're reflecting on writing.

3/19/2024 03:42:39 pm

The idea from Threshold Concepts that I’m thinking a lot about is reflection (5.4). I guess I’m thinking about this in terms of revision, because in seventh grade we do a lot more revision than invention (I’m doing my best to incorporate that, but we are very invention-resistant writers unless it’s narrative). As Taczak says, reflection is critical to the writing process, which I have seen in my own writing. I try to replicate that for my students, but I think I do it badly because it feels like I’m asking superficial questions. I’m not really sure what to ask them in order to prompt rich, useful reflection. One mistake I’ve been making is giving explicit reflection prompts only after a piece of writing has been turned in (one of the misconceptions that writers have about reflection mentioned in Threshold). I think that I definitely do informal reflection prompting as students are drafting and revising, but I also think it would be helpful for the students if I made it more explicit. Maybe “formal” reflection check ins at various points in the writing process. The biggest struggle for my students is the metacognition part–why they are writing the ways they are writing. A lot of the time, they are making rhetorical choices because I told them to, and both the students and I know that. I’m not really sure how I can change that in a way that would meet the seventh graders where they are.

Today, actually, my coworker (seventh grade history teacher) shared some student responses to a reflection questionnaire she had them fill out about their recent essay in her class. Some of the responses were pretty profound, so I want to ask her more about what questions she’s asking for the reflection process.

Thinking about Invention & Revision

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